Notes on Debates, 20 November 1782
Notes on Debates
MS (LC: Madison Papers). See Notes on Debates, 4 November 1782, ed. n. Following his Notes on Debates for 14 November (q.v.) and preceding the present item, JM wrote: “No Cong up till Novr.
| Monday 18. |  |
The Journals sufficiently explain the proceedings of these days.” |
| Tuesday 19 |
See , XXIII, 726–39; JM to Randolph, 19 November 1782, and n. 4.
Congress went into consideration of the Report of A Committee consisting of Mr. Carrol, Mr. McKean & Mr. Howel on two Memorials from the Legislature of Pennsylvania.1 The Memorials imported a disposition to provide for the Creditors of the U. S. within the State of Pena. out of the Revenues allotted for Congress, unless such provision could be made by Congress.2 The Report as an answer to the Memorials acknowledged the merit of the public3 Creditors, professed the wishes [p. 294] of Congress to do them justice; referring at the same time to their recommendation of the Impost of 5 PerCt. which had not been acceded to by all the States; to the requisition of 1,200,000 Drs. for the payment of one years interest on the public debt,4 and to their acceptance of the territorial cession made by N. Y.5 After some general conversation in which the necessity of the Impost as the only fund on which loans could be expected & the necessity of loans to supply the enormous deficiency of taxes,6 were urged, as also the fatal tendency of the plan intimated in the Memorials, as well to the union itself, as to the system actually adopted by Congress,7 the Report was committed.8
A motion was made by Mr. R——g——e, 2ded. by Mr. W——m——s——n9 to instruct the committee to report the best mode of liquidating the domestic debts, and of obtaining a valuation of the land within the several States, as the Article of Confederation directs. The first part of the instruction was negatived, provision having been previously made on that head.10 In place of it the Superintendt. of Finance was instructed to report the causes which impede that provision11 The 2d. part was with[d]rawn by the mover. A committee however was afterwards appointed, consisting of Mr. Rutlidge, Mr. Nash Mr. Duane Mr. Osgood & Mr. Madison, to report the best scheme for a valuation.12
1. Except for the instruction to the “Superintendt. of Finance,” mentioned near the close of these notes, the printed journal of Congress for 20 November bears no resemblance to what JM recorded for that day. Congress on 30 August had referred to a grand committee a memorial, dated two days earlier, of the Pennsylvania General Assembly asking for the payment of all or part of the money overdue from Congress to citizens of that state for interest on loan certificates and in satisfaction of other debts (NA: PCC, No. 69, II, 413–16; , XXIII, 539–40; , IV, 388, n. 13). On 1 November the grand committee’s report about this matter was referred to a committee comprising Daniel Carroll, Thomas McKean, and David Howell (NA: PCC, No. 186, fol. 65). To this committee was also consigned on 12 November a second memorial of the Pennsylvania General Assembly on the same subject (ibid., No. 69, II, 417–20; No. 185, III, 47; No. 186, fol. 66). Although unnoted in the printed journal, the committee rendered its report on 18 November (ibid., No. 186, fol. 66). See Notes on Debates, 4 December 1782.
2. See Report on Payment of New Jersey Troops, 1 October 1782, and ed. n., for a similar “disposition” on the part of New Jersey.
3. JM interlineated “public.”
4. See Randolph to JM, 6 August, n. 24; JM to Randolph, 16–17 September 1782, and nn. 11, 13.
5. See JM to Randolph, 29 October 1782, and n. 13.
6. See JM to Randolph, 19 November 1782, and n. 11.
7. See Report on Payment of New Jersey Troops, 1 October 1782, and ed. n.
8. Notice of the report and its committal was not entered in the journal but in Charles Thomson’s Committee Book (NA: PCC, No. 186, fol. 68; , XXIII, 745, [p. 295] n. 2). Daniel Carroll was chairman, and David Howell, Thomas FitzSimons (Pa.), James Duane, and David Ramsay were the other members of the committee. Before it reported on 30 January 1783, Howell had been replaced by Nathaniel Gorham of Massachusetts and Duane by Alexander Hamilton of New York (, XXIV, 99–105).
9. Probably some years after making his notes, JM wrote above the two abbreviated surnames, respectively, “Rutlidge” and “Williamson.”
10. The printed journal does not mention the Rutledge-Williamson motion, and no copy of it has been found in the PCC. The “best mode” of paying the domestic debt had been a main subject of Robert Morris’ “Report on Public Credit,” dated 29 July 1782, and of deliberations by a grand committee of Congress as early as January of that year (, IV, 56, n. 6; 140, n. 3; 188, and n. 3; JM to Randolph, 13 August, and n. 14; 10 September 1782, and n. 9). For the obligation imposed upon Congress by the eighth article of the Articles of Confederation to ascertain “the valuation of the land” and the buildings within each state before determining the state-by-state quotas of a financial requisition, see , XIX, 217.
11. For JM’s motion on this subject, see Motion on Instruction to Morris, 20 November 1782, and n. 2. This motion was not entered in the manuscript journal but in the journal Thomson maintained for the superintendent of finance (, XXIII, 745, n. 2).
12. Neither this motion, introduced by David Howell and seconded by Joseph Jones, nor the committee to which the motion was referred is entered in the journal. On 6 December Abraham Clark replaced James Duane (NA: PCC, No. 186, fol. 68). The committee submitted its report to Congress on 9 January 1783 (Notes on Debates, 9–10 January 1783, LC: Madison Papers).